Wednesday, August 27, 2008

Wow

After reading this, we should all be reminded that the real question is why scumbags like Ayers and Dohrn could become acquaintances of anyone in public life, let alone Senator Obama, when they should be rotting in jail cells.

(Hat tip to the Corner.)

28 comments:

Anonymous said...

1. C'mon, he's just a guy from Obama's neighborhood.
2. I wonder if Obama's campaign will write letters to the justice department to try and silence Murtagh.
3. Ayers is now influential in education policy. Sick world.
Paul

Anonymous said...

And to answer your question: They're close because they share the same views (America is not a land of opportunity; it's a land of oppression that commits terrorist acts around the world); kindred spirits. Same story with Jeremiah Wright. Obama could not have hung out with Ayers and Wright for 13 and 20 years, respectively, and not realize, and thus share, their radical viewpoints.
Paul

Tom said...

Actually, that was not my question at all. My questino was why Ayers et al. are not in jail. And it was largely rhetorical, because obviously they should be in jail on any number of charges from attempted murder to conspiracy to commit murder to treason.

(A similar question would be why didn't John Walker Lindh hang five years ago, for what was obviously treason?)

If our justice system cannot handle simple cases like these, what message does that send to the neighbors, including Senator Obama, of these nutbags?

Anonymous said...

Well then, I'll add my own question to the answer I gave above. Why would Obama let scumbags like Ayers and Dohrn into his circle, knowing about their past and lack of regret?
Paul

dcat said...

Ayers and Obama are not close. They have never been close. They served on a board of the Woods Foundation together for a short period. They did live in the same neighborhood. he did not "hang out" with Ayers. Ayers was never in Obama's inner circle, his outer circle, or any circle. These are deep and pernicious lies.

And the idea that Obama shares the views ascribed to him is laughable, indeed, is deeply dishonest and worthy of contempt. Why the hell is no one at Big Tent saying anything about Paul's babble?

As for why Ayers isn't in jail (with Dohrn): The government could not make the case against him without illegal wiretaps. They dropped the case and never picked it up again. Shouldn't have happened, but the case was dropped in 1979 against both, and neither Republicans and Democrats have not re-opened those charges if at this point they could be re-opened.

dcat

Paul said...

launching your political career in an unrepentant terrorist's home? what kind of relationship would you call that exactly?

Stephen said...

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5jOnqXMIhzLliGTOV69FEIftajObwD92QD8UG1

The most recent AP story

Anonymous said...

here we go again. Look, I don't expect conservatives to like, vote for, or support Obama. What I don't understand is the need to vilify him and make him completely unacceptable/beyond the pale. It seems to me that sophistacated people can disagree with someone without making them into someone they aren't. I understand that Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity do this stuff for ratings and that Moveon.org uses some of the same tactics for liberals or leftists--but Obama is not a Weatherman or a fellow traveler.

Reagan had contact with John Birchers and other right wing extremist groups--but that doesn't mean anything. Just b/c Obama knew Ayers is sooo completely irrelevant. I understand why right wing radio brings it up (for ratings) but you guys are much too smart for that. Or is this blog merely about Republican talking points rather than real ideas?

Jeff

Tom said...

For the love of pete, everyone read my original post:

"...we should all be reminded that the real question is why scumbags like Ayers and Dohrn could become acquaintances of anyone in public life, let alone Senator Obama, when they should be rotting in jail cells."

As far as I know, the assertion that Ayers and Dohrn should be in jail is not a Republican talking point (although it would be a pretty darn good Democrat one).

dcat said...

Tom --
Jeff and I aren't going after you. Your argument is fine and largely unobjectionable. Though I also answered the question about why they are not in jail cells, a question a simple Lexis-Nexis search (hell, a google search) would have answered. And while you did not intend the post to be a Republican talking point, the name Ayers has indeed become a Republican talking point.
Your argument is not a Republican talking point, and I never read it that way. But Paul and anonymous did pick up on the meme and said simplistic, dumb, and at times demonstrably false things. I guess this is what we can expect the entire election season: Arguments based not on the merits but on slimy innuendo. This should be loads of fun.

dcat

Stephen said...

I think it is fair to ask if he was friendly with Ayers or whether he merely tolerated him out of political expediency.

Anonymous said...

Tom,

Ditto. I couldn't agree more with Tom's original point. I am actually writing an article on the Weathermen and the ideas that influenced their heinous movement. I hate Dorhn and Ayers (especially Ayers) they are scumbags. Nonetheless, just b/c Obama dealt with some folks who were terrorists in 1970 doesn't really say much of anything about him. It does say much about the academy. How Dorhn and Ayers have become respected professors is just beyond the pale. That is an issue regarding the academic left's moral bankruptcy not Obama.

Jeff

Anonymous said...

Steve,

the attacks on Obama regarding Ayers aren't "questions" waiting for an actual answer--they are innuedos.

Jeff

Anonymous said...

Tom- I get it. Sorry I f***ed up your post's comment thread.

Jeff- Innuendo? Please.
Defenders of Obama, just answer one question: If you met Bill Ayers, would you spend time working with him on policy issues or would you be walk away knowing that he is an unrepentant terrorist? I can't wait for you guys to twist yourselves into pretzels trying to justify your answers if it's the former.
Paul

Anonymous said...

Paul,

If I met a university professor how on Earth would I know what he did 40 years ago? By the mid 1990s Bill Ayers was not a name anyone knew anymore. Paul, you don't agree with Obama but grown-ups understand that you don't need to demonize those you don't agree with. You see in the real world--decent, smart, and well-intentioned people can disagree on big issues. John McCain is a decent and honorable public servant so is Barack Obama---why is that so hard for you to admit?? Democrats and liberals are not traitorous child molesters--you simply disagree with them. Rush and Sean Hannity would demonize Jesus if he were a Democrats, that's fine b/c that is their job. Smart people realize the difference between political rhetoric/hackery and reality.

Jeff

Anonymous said...

You posted a bunch of jibberish and didn't bother answering the question. Blah, blah, blan you're not a grown-up. Blah, blah, blah Hannity and Rush suck. Blah, blah, blah you're not smart. Thanks for the self-righteous lecture, though.
Paul

Anonymous said...

Paul,

I didn't say Rush and Hannity sucked. In fact, I praised them for being good at their job. You need to realize the difference between red meat intended for ideologues and a mature understanding of the world and politics. Look, the McCain camp would be stupid not to use Ayers--but that doesn't mean smart conservatives can't tell the difference between politics and reality. If I wanted to, I could copy and paste talking points from Moveon.org about McCain but I realize the difference between criticism and silly talking points.

Jeff

Anonymous said...

That's all well and good, but Hannity and Rush are not the only ones pursuing this story.
Paul

Anonymous said...

Paul,
There is no "story." I suppose you prefer hating liberals and believing that they are nefarious and immoral rather than good patriotic Americans whom you disagree with. Enjoy your sad and small little world.

Jeff

Anonymous said...

Thanks, I will. I'm quite happy here with my gun and Bible.
Paul

dcat said...

Well, my candidate just gave the greatest speech in modern American political history. Enjoy your email conspiracies.

dcat

Anonymous said...

Seems to be the only thing he does well.
Paul

Anonymous said...

Great Patriots in America:
1. Jeremiah "God Damn America" Wright
2. Bill "America makes me want to puke" Ayers
3. Michelle "for the first time in my adult life, I'm proud of my country" Obama
4. Tony Eason

Paul

dcat said...

Paul --
You are such a fatuous little gasbag I do not know why I even waste time. Obama has laid out his vision. He has provided more concrete policy proscriptions than has McCain. He has rejected both Wright and Ayers. Michelle Obama had every right to say what she said. She is a remarkable and accomplished woman who has actually worked for what she accomplished.
Jeff gave what you called a "self righteous lecture" because he's smarter and writes better than you do. Maybe you ought to pay attention to people who, in the realm we are discussing -- politics -- have forgotten more than you have ever known.
We can agree on Tony Eason.

dcat

Anonymous said...

I don't know why you bother either. You just end up embarrassing yourself every time with your "I'm so much smarter than you" and "I'm so much more accomplished than you" bit.

I'll let you in on a little secret: smart doesn't equal right.
Paul

dcat said...

Paul --
Except in this case, I'm both and you're neither. (and in any case, I argued that Jeff was smarter than you. He is. More accomplished as well. Argument by authority is sometimes underrated.)

Knowing stuff usually equates to being able to form arguments about those things. The reality is that you are not capable of having an argument on the merits so you think you can play in the gutter. Except as Jeff has shown by stomping your ass in this discussion, when people are willing to lower themselves to the gutter, they are better at that than you as well.

So smarter, more accomplished, and right. It's a nice threesome. Maybe someday you'll at least be allowed to watch. You're sure as hell never going to be asked join.

dcat

Anonymous said...

DC
I was referring to you bragging about your CV in the other post (WaPo Ombudsman).
Paul

dcat said...

Oh, naturally. So you bring it up here. That makes sense.

dcat